Joy vs. Happiness
248 | “Little Oasises?”
Foster Joy and Happiness in Your Life
Rejoice! We're back for a new season with "Happy Days Ahead"! First up, we're untangling the relationship between joy and happiness. Is it okay for Christians to just be happy, or is happiness a shallow goal we should avoid? How can joy be a choice we make, yet also a fruit of the Spirit we receive? And what does it mean to "abide in the vine" to find the full joy that Jesus promises — the kind that can coexist with sadness? Join us as we explore appreciating happiness while building a life on unshakable joy!
Takeaways
The Big Idea: We can appreciate happiness as a gift, but we must foster joy to carry us through.
This Week's Challenge: This week, instead of chasing a feeling of joy, abide in Christ and gratefully notice his blessings throughout your day.
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Introduction and Episode Overview
Ryan: to have little oasises — oases?
Bryan: oasai? Well, hello everyone and welcome to the Bible geeks podcast. This is episode 248 I'm Bryan Schiele
Ryan: I'm Ryan Joy.
Bryan: and thanks so much everyone for tuning in today We'll explore the relationship between joy and happiness is joy automatic for Christians. Is it okay for Christians just to be happy? Maybe you've heard that happiness has been downplayed or thrown under the bus in some way like it's shallow or empty Maybe you've heard joy painted as some easy virtue for us all to achieve.
How is joy like an oasis in the desert? We'll talk about that and how they're different how they work together and why both of these two things joy and happiness Matter in a Christian's life and then we'll wrap it all up with a promise from Jesus about full joy We're excited to be back for another season Ryan.
You ready to go?
Ryan: Let's do it.
Bryan: Let's get into
Happy Days Ahead: Setting the Theme
Bryan: I was in the kitchen and I saw my daughter's Day planner and she has it sitting on the on the kitchen table and it's been there for a while and I walk by it Every day and I never actually made the connection of what was on the front of that day planner and it's a Snoopy day planner for 2026 and it says happy days ahead and I was just like yeah, that is the theme for this episode number one That's also the theme for I think our season that we're in happy days ahead.
Ryan: love that, I love that. Yeah, we, uh, my kids have been walking around singing this song they heard about, "I'm about to have a good day." And that's, that goes with that. Like, what a great, you know, what a great way to orient yourself towards life, is like, happiness and joy, and who doesn't want that? But, you know, there are some complicated things that come with thinking through happiness and joy, and so we're gonna, sort through things and think through what, what is, is there a difference between happiness and joy, and all of that.
But maybe we start with just something that's making us happy. Like, that's a fitting place to start, right? What's making you happy this week,
Personal Stories of Happiness
Bryan: Oh, man There's so many things that I could be happy about but one of the things here in Arizona that's obvious to most people is that it never rains here in the desert and This last week it started to think about hinting at rain and last night Sharilyn and I were at Costco and we get we just start hearing like all of the the Phones buzzing around us about some like weather event that's going on and we walked out of Costco like full full cart You know and just completely pouring buckets outside and so we had to like You know run through the rain and do all the pack in the car in the rain and like it was a ball man We had so much I felt like a kid again So that made me happy this week the weather and then you know, just playing out in the rain with my wife.
It was great How about you?
Ryan: That is, that is so awesome. I love, rain already is so special to, like, it's so, such a cause of joy for me, and I think it comes from living in Arizona most of my life, where, like, it's not that it doesn't rain very often, I mean, it does, actually. You get a good bit of rain, but it is always really meaningful, and it smells so good.
I think it smells better in Arizona than anywhere else, and it's, it's, I, yeah, I just love, I love getting out there. What's more, like, I'm recklessly, you know, like, David dancing in front of the Ark, than, like, going out in the rain and just, like, you don't have to dance, just being out in the rain and, like, accepting, I'm getting soaked, but I'm enjoying, you know, the goodness of God in bringing this out.
So, I love that
Bryan: I can see why a lot of people in other places would not enjoy rain as much because like it
Ryan: Seattle, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, here, it's, it's still great, but we get snow, and that's a blessing until it's not, and rain, and sunshine. It's, like, we're ready for summer to be over now, but sunshine is great, too. So,
Bryan: Hold that in your back pocket. It's a blessing until it's not I
Ryan: And, ooh, ooh,
Bryan: We'll talk a little bit more about that here in a minute.
Ryan: So, last night, we had two young people over to the house that are going to get married next year, and it was just such a joy, Adrian and I sitting down and talking with them and hearing how excited they are to be with each other, and how their friendship and their, you know, being weird together and feeling like they get each other in a way that, like, nobody else is in our world.
And it was just, it brought me back to, you know, yeah, this is what, this is why I love marriage. This is why, you know, I was, have always been so excited to be in this special bond with a person that sort of, you know, shares this oneness that nobody else does. So, just thinking about the gift of marriage and excited about other people enjoying it, that's kind of on my mind here
Bryan: Did they finish each other's Sandwiches,
Ryan: Sandwiches, yeah, yeah, they basically did, yeah. [laughs]
Bryan: All right.
Deep Thoughts: Joy vs. Happiness
Bryan: So, you know, we're talking about joy We're talking about happiness and there is you know, there's a lot of conflation with these two ideas I think a lot of people get kind of hung up on what's the difference between joy and happiness and you know We'll get into some of the questions that we have here in a little bit in our next segment, which is called Deep Thoughts.
All right. So here in this segment I think we're gonna get into three different levels of depth on the topic of joy and happiness And I think it's helpful if we just start right on the surface Where people get all mixed up about joy and happiness like we were just talking about How do you see people Ryan get so mixed up about the difference between joy and happiness or even just about happiness itself?
Ryan: so we're going to, like, distinguish them, but sort of acknowledge that a lot of times you could just use the two interchangeably, you know. I mean, they're very similar ideas, but I think it is helpful as we get into this, we'll see it more, for your spiritual well-being to notice the distinction between happiness and joy.
And just talking about happiness, one way I think people get mixed up about happiness is just chasing it, like, that is what all of life is about. I mean, I think that's almost a default setting for most people is to think, "My purpose is to be happy. Like, that's why I am here, and that drives everything I do."
And so if I'm not happy, then there's this disruption in everything. It's like everything is wrong. And if I find something that makes me happy, then chasing it. And then oftentimes it's like happiness gets mixed up with, like, it's exactly the same thing as pleasure and comfort and ease, like these simple — which, hey, those things are nice, you know, and they're not wrong in the proper biblical context.
And so those are happy-making things, but there's more to happiness than just seeking pleasure. And then, you know, there's this deeper level. I mean, what about you? Where
have you seen yourself or other people get mixed up about happiness?
Biblical Insights on Joy and Happiness
Bryan: think I think you're on to something there when you're talking about it being this Almost like a pendulum shift and that's that's the default thought process I have here is like when you allow your chasing and pursuit of happiness to go to the extreme or to like, you know Perspectively push out your understanding of you know that God doesn't want you Necessarily as your whole goal in life to be happy so you've got like James 1 17, right? Every good gift every perfect gift is from above coming down from the Father of lights It's God who gives us these amazing good things the rain that we enjoy the relationships that we have in marriage these these amazing things We have we get to enjoy them and like, you know You go back to the garden as we as we talked about in the last season you go back to that time when God was In the presence of humanity and it's like I was that was a happy time, right?
This is that was an amazing time for God to be in the midst of his people and he richly Blesses us with all these things but boy like you just said it was it's if the pursuit of happiness and the pursuit of pleasure Becomes my idol when it really
Ryan: a great word for it.
Bryan: the problem Yeah, because it's it's just that idea that like, you know You're you're pursuing that as like the ideal in your life and that's where I think a lot of times Happiness gets thrown under the bus and we'll talk about that in a second But I think that's where happiness gets thrown under the bus because we see people only pursuing happiness We're like, well that must be bad, right?
Happiness must be bad because you know people just want to pursue it a hundred percent of the time and it's like no But God gives us these things to be happy doesn't he?
Ryan: does God want you to be happy? What a great question. You know, I mean, like, he has blessed us so richly. You know, the book of Ecclesiastes comes to mind as, like, this book that talks a lot about being — about enjoying life. And there is an under-the-sun perspective where that starts to — starts to lead him to go too far in chasing happiness.
And then, like, in chapter 2, he realizes, "Well, this isn't — everything feels meaningless, because that's not where it's at." But he keeps settling back into, "But it is good to just enjoy — enjoy life, enjoy food, enjoy your wife, enjoy your friends, enjoy your life in all the days you have. This is a gift from God."
I had a study with some young people here recently where we were in the book of Ecclesiastes, and I wanted them to see both the value of enjoying life and sort of being happy now, and about investing in joy forever, right?
And so I brought them to Ecclesiastes where it says in Ecclesiastes 11.9, "Rejoice, O young man, in your youth, and let your heart cheer you in the days of your youth. Walk in the ways of your heart and the sight of your eyes." And, you know, I was like, "How many times have you heard a sermon where the preacher said, 'Hey, have fun.
You're young. Enjoy yourself.'" And they're like, "Yeah, I haven't." But then we went to the — we went to the "but." "But know that for all these things God will bring you into judgment." But he says, "Remove vexation from your heart and put away pain from your body. For youth and the dawn of life are vanity. Remember also your Creator in the days of your youth before the evil days come."
So there's this balancing, but certainly there's a reason to be happy right now. So kind of talking about that pendulum you brought up, have you heard people kind of imply that happiness is almost empty or shallow or just so caught up in making sure we don't overemphasize happiness, temporal, short-term happiness, that we downplay it maybe too much?
Have you gotten that impression?
Bryan: Yeah, well, I think that's really the genesis of this whole episode It's why it really resonated with me a lot is because yeah, I I hear especially a lot of Christians I hear a lot of Christians focused on joy, which is almost I think we'll talk about it is gonna be a choice You choose joy irrespective of your situation around you happiness though Definitely feels like it gets thrown under the bus for me in Christian circles in discussions with believers It's like that happiness over there.
That's only temporary. That's a reaction to the things going on around you and it's like yeah But I mean when things are going well around you shouldn't you be happy? Like shouldn't you use that moment to to be happy and those? Blessings that God is giving you and all the things that you get to experience So I think there is this really deep tension between joy and happiness and it's really I think where the second level of this Conversation hits pretty hard, you know if on the surface we're really thinking yeah people get kind of mixed up about happiness They make get mixed up about joy below the surface though, you know, let's understand happiness and joy a little bit more and Distinguishing happiness from joy is kind of where I was just headed there.
It's like how do you distinguish? Happiness and joy and it's a it's an analogy that gets thrown around a lot and I think even you Preached a sermon where you use this analogy as well. It's like the the thermostat versus the thermometer analogy
Yeah, so like happiness is like a thermometer happiness is just telling you what's going on right now around you It's saying alright, it's you know, 98 degrees outside here in Phoenix this morning And it's like that's that's just telling you what's happening around you Whereas joy is a thermostat which is you know, it might be telling you what what's going on around you But it also has some amount of control over changing that situation or you know Setting a new trajectory for making a different decision And so I think joy and happiness are distinct from each other But I mean in true biblical joy, I think there is a recognition that yeah when good things are happening Happiness is absolutely a result of that.
I don't know. What do you what do you think about
Ryan: There's a steadiness to joy insofar as there is a
steadiness to our relationship with the Lord and a steadiness to our hope and our gratitude. And I think — I don't know. I'm interested in what you think of this. I think happiness and joy are both emotions.
Do you think so, or do you think joy is something different than an emotion?
Bryan: well with joy being one of the fruit of the Spirit love joy peace, you know Love is clearly an emotion. I think joy fits right in there with that I would say it is happiness is absolutely an emotion for sure.
Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
The Choice of Joy in Difficult Times
Ryan: So I think it's — I mean, it's like, how do you — you said joy is a choice, and I agree with that. I think that's an important distinction. But I think it's maybe not just the choice of, "I'm going to have joy right now." Maybe it is. Maybe it's just that simple. But sometimes I think we can get stuck in joylessness, even as faithful Christians.
It is different than the distinction between being happy and sad, because I think joy and sadness can coexist. Paul talked about, in 2 Corinthians 6:10 being sorrowful yet always rejoicing.
Bryan: that's like one of the biggest verses for that right because it's like clearly right there always rejoicing yet Sorrowful. I mean, how do you how do you argue with
that?
Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So you can have joy and be sorrowful. So just because you're sad doesn't mean that?
you're somehow missing on the fruit of the Spirit of joy. But I feel like joy is a byproduct, for me anyways, in my experience of doing things or setting my posture and my attitude and my thinking in a certain direction.
Whenever I give thanks to God, it starts to move me towards joy. Whenever Iam just close to God, I'm worshiping, I'm praying, I'm serving others even, brings me out of my funk. And yeah, I might still be — It could be still bittersweet.
There could be something that's real in life, that's a reason to mourn. Jesus was mourning many times in his life. And yet I have this abiding fullness, this abiding sense peace and lightness. And boy, it's hard to describe joy. How would you even describe
Bryan: I Think you're right on the on the mark though To tack on to that comment about joy?
and sadness coexisting I think about first Peter one when Peters describing that you rejoice though now for a little while if necessary You've been grieved by various trials and he's really saying like, you know, you believe in him rejoice with joy That is inexpressible filled with glory like your joy comes as a result of your relationship with Jesus his presence in your life And yeah You're gonna face a lot of stuff because of that like you're going to go through a lot of difficulties Even Jesus when he prayed in John 17 is talking about the difficulties that are gonna come yet He wants his disciples to have his joy and you know, we'll get into that in more detail later in the conversation But I feel like joy comes like you were saying in this steadiness in our relationship with the Lord and our closeness with him I'm gonna throw in one more verse Psalm 16 verse 11 This verse makes me laugh so hard because of something that Sharilyn used to tell me when she was a kid at her church when she was growing up the announcer would get up at the end and say, you know We're so grateful for your presence today and as a kid Sharilyn would be really upset Like how come I didn't get presents today is you know, she would be so upset Like I why aren't I getting all the presents and so Psalm 16 verse 11 says you made known to me the path of life in Your presence there is fullness of joy at your right hand are pleasures evermore Joy is truly found in God's presence Not just his presence and so
Ryan: [laughs]
Bryan: you have to write that out to really understand what I'm saying there But but you know what I'm talking about.
It's it's not this like it's not the the blessings alone are the source of joy It is the presence of God It's the closeness and connection with him that brings us such joy and no matter what we go through even if it's difficult Even if we're like Peter says grieved by various trials we can still choose better.
Ryan: And I think that is — What you're on to is so helpful in sort of diagnosing a real obstacle to joy. I think for us, all of us, at least for myself and I think others that I talk to today, a lot of times it's not sorrow that's getting in the way, it's being scattered. It's not having presence in God's presence.
[laughs]
Bryan: Oh, here we are a third one, right? Good job. Yeah way to
Ryan: This idea of getting fragmented and pulled in different directions so that I'm not settling into, or as Jesus says, abiding in the Lord, in
his presence, in being with him and serving him and understanding and accepting and embracing through faith the truths he's given me.
And that work is the work that just shifts everything. Because then, I mean, even temptations and difficulties, you're not — It's hard to get angry whenever you're
really
abiding in the joy of the Lord's presence. I think that's why Paul in Philippians 4 says, "Hey, rejoice in the Lord always
as a prescription, as a way of dealing with this conflict that these two ladies are having." There at the beginning of chapter 4 of Philippians. You know, if you rejoice, it's going to help you out of this because you're clearly losing your perspective, your mind of Christ that lets you have this focus on the things that matter and be rejoicing in the Lord if you're debating and having dispute over unimportant things.
Bryan: is a huge piece of that also, you know as you start to as you start to become I don't know I'm gonna say lukewarm or When your love for Christ grows weak as we sing in that song
I think those are times where we forget about his presence and again I think you're we're saying the same thing in general is is that it's a it's a forgetfulness or a Distraction or that we're not we're not living presently Like you said in the moment thinking about God's relationship with us and his leading and guidance for us that we're just kind of you Know adrift and we're not really seeing things as clearly and I think as we're talking about this this deep thoughts segment We go into the deep in our third level here and we start to see how everything fits together And how does joy make an impact in a Christian's life and we've been talking around it a little bit there But but joy is a choice.
I think it is really is a choice, but it's a choice not to just like Manufacture happiness like and that's that's where I think this discussion is really helpful for me It's not about like, you know putting on a smile and being peppy and like because I think oftentimes we equate joy with like Bubbliness or like happiness or you know, and that those two things can be connected to each other But joy can be really found in in very difficult sad circumstances like we've talked about but just that Constant like you said abiding and I think it really is why joy is a fruit of the Spirit It is it is coming from a a genuine Connection of the Spirit in our life and that comes, you know, so vividly I think when we're in the word when we're when we're meditating on God's Word when we're praying to him when we're worshipful Every day that joy is just gonna be there Even though our outer man may be perishing as as we know is so often case.
Ryan: think a great example of the choice is Habakkuk,
right? As he is —
In fact, maybe this is where Paul is almost quoting or alluding to the end of the book of Habakkuk in "Rejoice in the Lord Always" in Philippians 4.4, he talks about how — So there's this journey from frustrated that God isn't doing anything about the evil he sees in Israel and then to hearing that God is bringing Babylon to judge his people and wait a minute, that's not the answer.
They're even worse than us. How could you do that, God? And God's answer is, "The righteous will live by faith." So trust me. Put your stable, loyal faith in me. And at the end of the journey, he says, "So okay, I'm going to wait. I'm going to wait for you to bring judgment on — I'm going to quietly wait for the day of trouble," he says in verse 16.
And he says in 17 of chapter 3, "Though the fig tree should not blossom, nor fruit be on the vines, the produce of the olive fail, and the fields yield no food, the flock be cut off from the fold, and there be no herd in the stalls." I mean, I don't know how we would translate everything going wrong in life.
I don't have money for my mortgage payment. I'm behind at work. My kid is having trouble at school, whatever. Everything is going wrong.
Bryan: internet constantly disconnects on me.
Ryan: air conditioning in Phoenix isn't working. And yet — and so verse 18 starts, "And yet I will rejoice in the Lord." It's not, "And so I will rejoice in the Lord."
It's, "And yet," in spite of all that, he's making the choice. "Yet I will rejoice in the Lord. I will take joy in the God of my salvation. God the Lord is my strength. He makes my feet like the deer's. He makes me tread on high places." And so he's learned the lesson of "The righteous will live by faith." That's how you deal with things you don't understand, with things that are disrupting you, is you trust, "God is good.
I know he's good. I know he loves. I know he has done so much already to change everything for me, and he is going to work things in a way that I might never — I mean, you know, like I don't need to understand. God gets it, and I just rest in him, and therefore I rejoice in the Lord." It's a game changer.
Bryan: I also start to think though now you you begin to like look back at happiness in like a distant view You're like, oh, there's there's happiness back there. Wait, we did, you know We've just been really focused here in the last few minutes about joy But where does happiness fit into all of this again?
Cuz it's like wait isn't happiness coming along for the ride Like are these are these really the same things and I don't know again I don't I don't think they are but like it reminds me of Paul, you know Being able to rejoice in his imprisonment in the book of Philippians and other places, you know Just just such a joyful book in Philippians and the entire time he's in chains Okay, come on now Paul like are you just faking it till you make it but like I don't think so Like I think joy and happiness are very connected together But for a lot of us joy is so much more important than happiness But happiness is always something to be appreciated to be valued I think to be acknowledged to God, but it is a it is a poor foundation for us to build our life around I feel like joy is more of like the destination and Happiness is like the signpost kind of pointing us in that direction in a way It's not the destination happiness is not the destination pleasure is not the destination But eventually a life of sustaining joy and deep connection to God I mean that is ultimately what our hope is all about right isn't that what what hope is like hope is about an everlasting Never-ending joy and happiness someday, but I don't think we're ever gonna get there fully today in our life right now in terms of happiness at least
Ryan: that brings you to a really good place of like, "I think we'll be happy in heaven." So happiness must be good, and, you know, happiness must be something that, you know, that God desires for us. But we have — it's like living the story. We are here to live out our story, and just like Jesus did, and just like, you know, the journey that God has been bringing us through, there is a battle to fight, and there are difficulties, and there are things that are going to stretch us and grow us.
And so James says, James 1, verses 2 to 4, "Have joy, considerate joy, whenever things get really hard." And whenever, like, no sane person would be happy that this is happening, like, you know, losing somebody you love. Like, that's not a reason to be happy. Or, you know, just rough things happening in the world you live in, things that test you, things that really, you know, throw a monkey wrench into everything.
But considerate joy, and then he gives a reason, because it's producing something. It's producing in the long-term story that we're living out, a different kind of person. It's refining us into having more perseverance, more hope, seeing beyond this moment into eternity so that we can live, live for eternity in this moment.
So, yeah, I mean, but also I think that this can all create some guilt for somebody maybe who's a Christian, who's faithful, who's thinking, "Am I doing — am I having, like, a crisis, or am I doing something wrong? Because I feel like I'm not feeling a particular feeling that I should be feeling." And so I'm asking the question, you know, we don't want to let feelings be our guide in our faith, you know, the heart is deceitful above all things.
You use the term signpost. How can happiness and/or joy be something to pay attention to as we're navigating things, and how could that lead us astray? [
Bryan: you and I have talked about and I think we've mentioned it on the show before but like I was gonna say I'm gonna I should go get my Birkenstocks. Hold on one second, but You know to feel our bodies and again, this is a for those who know, you know what
I'm saying? But to to pay attention and tune in to your body is a really powerful thing to know what's going on with you So like when your shoulders start to tense and your teeth start to grit and you know that like there's stress coming and you can Start to feel it in your body.
I think it's helpful for you to tune into those things So in the same way, I think when you tune into your body and you can start to feel happiness That is that's a that's a pointer and I think for me the reminder for me is tune in and say thank you Like that should be a moment where I turn to God and say thank you But like you were just talking about sometimes we tune in and we don't feel happy and sometimes we tune into our body and we feel stressed out and anxious and sad and we're down in the dumps that is also another moment for us to tune in and to pray to God and cast our Cares on him and like I think you were just talking about from James you have this at least for me I think this is where it comes into play the most you have this moment where you start to look ahead and you you like You time travel into the future and you say I don't know what's going on in the future I don't know what this is gonna look like But I know when I get there God will have been doing something to lead me to that and kind of like Joseph You know you think about all the times when he was in such terrible conditions But it was all leading him somewhere to the point where he was able to say you all meant this for evil But God meant it for good and I don't think that was like a brand new fresh revelation by Joseph I think the entire time he was living through those circumstances.
He had that in mind I think he knew that God was doing something for him through all those difficulties and maybe maybe that's a helpful Reminder is just when you are having those moments of stress and anxiety and you're sad about stuff Like it like it should be with happiness as a signpost to say tune in figure out what's going on here And you don't have to have the answers, but you at least need to know what you what your response to those things should be
Ryan: yeah, pay attention. Pay attention to what's happening with you. And
I think that sometimes, you know, you'll find gifts that you have because you — whenever you are greeting people in the, you know, Sunday morning service as they're coming in, and you're happy about it, well, hey, that can actually be a signpost to, "Hey, this is something that I am particularly good at. I'm particularly good at going and, you know, visiting an assisted living place because that's something that is, you know, is a blessing to me.
I didn't want to do it, this particular task, whatever it is, but then when I was doing it, I noticed that I was — I experienced joy or happiness, and I think those can be helpful. It's not that you only do the things that bring you joy and happiness, but it can be helpful to notice what those things are and be aware.
Awareness — and the Bible word for it is watchfulness, right? Watchfulness, being aware of what's going on and circumspect what's going on within me, what's going on around me, is a really helpful thing. Mm-hmm,
Bryan: And I think it's really what we're saying here is that I think we can appreciate Happiness as a gift that you know we use these moments as a blessing from God of course but our our focus should really be on fostering joy and having this kind of stability and Relationship with God that just brings us joy and a and a trust in him that can see that though I might not be happy about this right now though though this may not be a great situation You know physically speaking right now.
I trust him enough to stick with him even in the difficult things I think that's that's kind of what we're saying here And the best way I can think to do that is to have a relationship with Jesus and maybe that's where we're headed next
Jesus Said: John 15:11
Ryan: Yeah, we always want to bring this back to Jesus, and we want to bring this back here to something that Jesus said here in a minute, but what we were just talking about, looking forward, looking for the joy beyond the moment. Like I might not be experiencing all of the happiness I want. It makes me think of how Jesus, Hebrews 12, too, says, "For the joy set before him, he endured the cross."
He was living for something that he saw out in front of him. There is an eternal joy that was infusing
everything he did, and I think if we come to understand Jesus' joy, then we can better understand the joy he wants us to have. So going back to what Jesus says here in John 15, 11, he doesn't just give us a command to be joyful here.
He's talking about the vine and the branches, and he says, "These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you, and that your joy may be full." And so what do you think is the key here to understanding joy that this little statement of Jesus helps us unlock?
Bryan: it's hard to pull this verse out of context right but John 15 verse 11 We know what this is talking about. This is the vine This is Jesus whole conversation about the vine and the importance of being connected with the source of life And so I'm seeing Jesus here saying that joy is really rooted in a relationship with God And of course a rooted in a relationship with him that makes that that connection possible It was it is being driven by the will of God It's listening to God's instructions his command and just being totally purpose driven by all of that and like I love the the verse you Use there in Hebrews 12 - because it's a perfect encapsulation holding two things side by side Which should not make any sense Jesus was joyful to die and he was joyful to die Because he understood what was coming as a result of that he understood What was on the horizon for that and so the moment itself was sorrowful of course?
But the happiness that would come after that would just make that entire sorrow just go and melt away and so much of our life Is called to have that same attitude Isn't it like just to realize that you are gonna be as you would go on to talk about in in John 17 in his prayer That he want he wanted his disciples to have my joy fulfilled in themselves and in that prayer He's really telling them like look you're gonna suffer because I suffered you're gonna suffer just like I suffered So you're gonna go through things but my joy can be in you and be full And I think the whole reason for that is because there's a vision about what is coming ahead and not what's going on right now And so it's just a perspective shift. It's about perspective It's about purpose, and it's really just having a having a different view of difficulty Then boy my natural person just really does not feel comfortable thinking about you know difficulty in that way But but that's what joy is really that's what Jesus joy
Ryan: and purpose. Those are two great words, and they're not emotions, right? So it just highlights again, whenever we shift our perspective, align with our purpose, and
have faith in Christ, you know, abide in Christ, put ourselves in a relationship of obedience and honor and trust in him, then we used this word earlier, the joy is a byproduct.
That's the choice, is the choice is to be right with Jesus and to abide in him, and a byproduct — another word for byproduct — is a fruit. fruit of the Spirit. It's a fruit of following the Spirit and living with Jesus. And so Jesus says, "You're going to have my joy," and he wants us to have his joy fully abiding in us because we're abiding in him.
And so if his joy is rooted in communion with the Father and obedience and love and hope, then that's the kind of joy that we're going to have. And what a cool thing, like this joy. He is living with joy because he is ever communing perfectly with the Father and the Spirit, and he's inviting us to be part of that communion, to be one with him as he is one with the Father, and to have the joy that he has in the Father.
If we can just keep — man, if I can just keep my mind where it needs to be and keep coming back throughout every day to trust in him and abide in him, then that — it just happens. It just is a steady — I mean, I guess maybe there's ups and downs, but there's this sense of him with me, and that is another name — at least for me, that is another name for the joy of the Lord.
Reach Out Question
Bryan: you know what else brings me joy what brings me joy
is a reach-out question and boy I have missed that little stinger Okay, so what does it mean here to abide in the vine? We've been talking about this word a little bit What does it actually look like in your life to practice this kind of thing today?
What it what are you thinking of when you're thinking of abiding in the vine practically speaking?
Ryan: what? Well, Jesus says we need to abide in his words in this passage and abide in him, and he's going to produce fruit in us. Abide means to live, to dwell. It's where am I locating my life? And I'm locating my life in him. And so practically — I mean, those are big theological ideas, I guess. Practically, for me, that means removing the obstacles like what we talked about earlier, the scatteredness.
Practical Tips for Finding Joy
Ryan: So to center myself, to slow down, to have little oasises — oases?
Bryan: Oasai?
Ryan: Oasai? Little places in my day where I can find to drink of the living water, where I can find to enjoy his presence in the desert of life, so to speak. So I need to find moments, to create moments in my day, every day, to pray, to reflect on who he is, to meditate on scripture, to make sure that I'm aligning my choices with where am I getting out of tune with his will for me, with the Spirit's will for me. And as I am just conscious of living in Jesus' presence and following him and obeying him and trusting him, I'm abiding in him, and the fruit just comes from it.
So like practically, I guess, to summarize that, for me, it means tuning throughout the day into what he wants for me
Bryan: You basically gave me every single answer that you possibly could and I appreciate that because you've taken all of the ones that I could Have provided off the table, but I will agree with you that I think you know these little Connective moments throughout the day where you're checking in and that's helpful in terms of oasis of check-in However, you might refer to that But I do appreciate having those regular moments of prayer or those regular moments of Bible study those regular worshipful moments Throughout the day and that is I think what you know we've been talking about here is just making making joy a choice and Keeping that connection because the the further you are from from being connected with the Lord the further I am from really thinking about his Word every day meditating on it the easier it is for me to get caught up in the circumstances In life and not be the kind of thermostat that tries to change the temperature of the day.
Ryan: I think this is a really helpful distinction for me, is the difference between trying to find happiness or joy versus connecting to the vine and noticing, gratefully,
happiness and joy. It's
like not removing it from my vocabulary and thought process,
Bryan: Manufacturing it
yourself. it. Yeah, Yeah,
that's a big one
Ryan: appreciating it gratefully
Bryan: just to bring it back to what we want for people. What do we want for our kids? What do we want for the people in our lives and everyone? And we do want happiness, of course, but what we want more is this abiding joy that is just like a deeper thing that is going to change how you
Ryan: make
choices in your life.
It's really going to change everything because it comes from just living in the presence of God, and it's the best thing. It's so great. It's so great. And you forget to pay attention, and you forget. Also, I think the new normal that we have in Christ, where that's just like a regular thing, is to live with joy and to forget that not everybody has that.
Not everybody is living every day knowing
the
one who made everything knows them and loves them and is working in their life, and everything in the end is going to be okay, and everything in the end is going to be in his
The Challenge
Ryan: hands, worked out. Yeah.
Bryan: Well, I think that's well said and I think it leads us actually in to our challenge for the week
So if I could summarize what you were just talking about in that last section You were sort of standing atop the mountain looking at your life and sort of viewing it from afar in this big sort of grand Perspective, you know at the end of all of this we want we want joy and we want this abiding connection with Christ I think one of the most helpful challenges to make that happen is to implement it in small ways during the day and so this week instead of chasing a feeling of joy or happiness abide in Christ and Gratefully notice his blessings throughout your day and that can that can pop up in lots of different ways But just making it a regular part of your day of your routine these oases of the day that you can just tune into What made you happy today?
What what has God blessed you with today? What are you struggling with that? Maybe God is gonna lead you into a stronger and more purposeful Abiding trusting kind of place at some point all these different moments We can tune in and and really I think connect with a deeper sense of
Ryan: James 5.13 says, "Is anyone among you cheerful? Let him sing praises." So if you're happy, you're feeling cheerful.
Yeah, if you're happy and
you know
Bryan: Oh, sorry wrong song
Ryan: it, there's a lesson right there. If you're happy, try to know it
and
Bryan: And
Ryan: thanks for it and then clap your hands and focus on the vine, right? Focus on getting rooted, staying rooted in the presence of Christ and in the life he is leading you toward by obeying him and trusting him. And boy, I just want to quote all the songs.
"Trust and obey. There is no other way to be happy in Jesus."
Bryan: Thank you, thank you Ryan for quoting all of the hymns to us. I appreciate it. so as we wrap up this episode, it's been a really good one on joy and happiness and the confusing distinction between them Hopefully we've sort of clarified a little bit. I'm taking away from this conversation with a call to action for myself to really grab on to those intentional moments throughout the day I think finding times regular oasis of time I suppose to to make those Intentional choices to be more joyful to notice and show gratitude to the Lord I think those are times where I can really just tune in to being a more joyful person
happiness is good It's just not the ultimate goal at the end of the day. What about
Ryan: I was thinking about the oases thing too. That is a big one for me, just, like, that I'll be working this week. And with that, the understanding that the choice of joy is not, like, smiling through the pain, like, grit your teeth, but there's a smile on — you know, it's It's not fake. It's not willful. There is a choice of will, but it's a choice to keep tuning into God and God's ways and then letting that fruit be produced.
It's a fruit of the Spirit, not a fruit of Ryan. And so knowing that joy is
going to come with my following the Lord and really slowing down
my rushing life to focus on Him, and then I think, you know, something we didn't talk about, but it's sort of behind all of it in my mind, is the effect that that has in our life.
We talked about how it can affect, you know, not being angry, affect you in temptation, affect you making better choices. We didn't talk about the verse from Nehemiah that says, "The joy of the
Lord is my strength," but that idea that whenever I have joy in the Lord, I am stronger. And so there is a very practical — it's not just about, you know, happiness is nice, joy is, you know, a fun feeling to have.
It's like this is how we overcome. This is what we bring to the battle, is the strength that comes from the joy of the Lord. So what is the devil going to attack? He's going to try to take your joy away. And so how do you get it back? Go back to abiding in the vine, abiding in His words, following
Conclusion and Upcoming Episodes
Bryan: Well, that's solid So there's been a good conversation on joy and happiness and really I think sets the stage for this entire season Really excited this season to be focused on joy and happiness and the fun and we're bringing it back to Bible geeks old-school We're gonna do some really cool stuff this season, especially in October Which will we'll just give you a nod that that's some fun stuff and very nerdy things are gonna occur in October Thank you all so much for tuning in on our next episode.
We're going to cover a Christian's Relationship with time we're going back in time. We're gonna stay in the present and then we're going to travel into the future I don't know what's gonna happen, but it's gonna be great Thank you so much everyone for tuning in and you can find show notes for this episode in your podcast player of choice or at Bible geeks dot FM You can also follow along with everything that we've been talking about here by subscribing to the show if you're not already I don't even know how you're listening to this if you're not subscribed to the show But but we would love it if you would rate and review the show That's something we don't ask for very often But please if you're back for another season with us Give us a rating drop a comment in there and iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts We would really appreciate that and until the next conversation everyone.
May the Lord bless you and keep